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	<title>Comments on: The Roe Effect, Democrats, and Shakers</title>
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	<link>http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/</link>
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	<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jul 2008 02:20:43 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: conservativeintelligencer.com &#124; Republicans and Evangelicals Have Babies, Democrats and Seculars Buy Small Dogs</title>
		<link>http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-211106</link>
		<dc:creator>conservativeintelligencer.com &#124; Republicans and Evangelicals Have Babies, Democrats and Seculars Buy Small Dogs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Apr 2008 23:35:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-211106</guid>
		<description>[...] Conservative Custos Fidei Moore Thoughts Dad Manly Posse Incitatus   These icons link to social bookmarking sites where readers can share [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Conservative Custos Fidei Moore Thoughts Dad Manly Posse Incitatus   These icons link to social bookmarking sites where readers can share [...]</p>
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		<title>By: daylesford accommodation</title>
		<link>http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-199636</link>
		<dc:creator>daylesford accommodation</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Feb 2008 23:53:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-199636</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;daylesford accommodation&lt;/strong&gt;

daylesford accommodation</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>daylesford accommodation</strong></p>
<p>daylesford accommodation</p>
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		<title>By: Dr. Duane Peters</title>
		<link>http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-190250</link>
		<dc:creator>Dr. Duane Peters</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jan 2008 18:22:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-190250</guid>
		<description>You need to study up on the vast difference between conditioning and genetic predisposition. We share the same opinion, but your complete and utter misuse of statistics and a spurious argument do a lot to undermine the conservative movement. I suggest reading a good textbook on using critical thinking frameworks to analyse social problems; your argument wouldn't pass the first round of analysis, unfortunately, but I do think it's possible to craft a logically consistent argument with the same conclusion that does.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You need to study up on the vast difference between conditioning and genetic predisposition. We share the same opinion, but your complete and utter misuse of statistics and a spurious argument do a lot to undermine the conservative movement. I suggest reading a good textbook on using critical thinking frameworks to analyse social problems; your argument wouldn&#8217;t pass the first round of analysis, unfortunately, but I do think it&#8217;s possible to craft a logically consistent argument with the same conclusion that does.</p>
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		<title>By: Moe Hong</title>
		<link>http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189884</link>
		<dc:creator>Moe Hong</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 23:31:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189884</guid>
		<description>I don't think you passed high school statistics, did you?

You do realize that 78% of the women who have an abortion end up bringing a child to term later, correct? And that 24% of adoptions terminate a second or later pregnancy? (Hepplewhite 1997)

Your ideas of causality are tremendously skewed and don't actually have any data behind them, do they?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think you passed high school statistics, did you?</p>
<p>You do realize that 78% of the women who have an abortion end up bringing a child to term later, correct? And that 24% of adoptions terminate a second or later pregnancy? (Hepplewhite 1997)</p>
<p>Your ideas of causality are tremendously skewed and don&#8217;t actually have any data behind them, do they?</p>
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		<title>By: Sean Braisted</title>
		<link>http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189826</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean Braisted</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 18:49:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189826</guid>
		<description>I recommend you read this &lt;a href="http://people-press.org/reports/display.php3?ReportID=300" rel="nofollow"&gt;Pew study on Youth&lt;/a&gt;...the results are basically that views about abortion among young people are the same as with other age groups, however, we are far more likely to support giving women earlier control over whether they have a child.

&lt;i&gt;"By a margin of 59%-32% Gen Nexters favor allowing women to get the so-called morning
after pill without a doctor’s prescription. Older generations are more skeptical about this proposal – 46% of those over age 25 favor making the morning-after pill available and 43% oppose this."?&lt;/i&gt;

We are also the most liberal generation.

&lt;i&gt;In addition to being more Democratic, Gen Nexters are more liberal than their older counterparts. When asked to describe their political views, 26% of Nexters say they are liberal; 36% describe themselves as moderate; and 29% say they are conservative. Fewer older Americans think of themselves as liberal and more identify themselves as conservative.&lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I recommend you read this <a href="http://people-press.org/reports/display.php3?ReportID=300" rel="nofollow">Pew study on Youth</a>&#8230;the results are basically that views about abortion among young people are the same as with other age groups, however, we are far more likely to support giving women earlier control over whether they have a child.</p>
<p><i>&#8220;By a margin of 59%-32% Gen Nexters favor allowing women to get the so-called morning<br />
after pill without a doctor’s prescription. Older generations are more skeptical about this proposal – 46% of those over age 25 favor making the morning-after pill available and 43% oppose this.&#8221;?</i></p>
<p>We are also the most liberal generation.</p>
<p><i>In addition to being more Democratic, Gen Nexters are more liberal than their older counterparts. When asked to describe their political views, 26% of Nexters say they are liberal; 36% describe themselves as moderate; and 29% say they are conservative. Fewer older Americans think of themselves as liberal and more identify themselves as conservative.</i></p>
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		<title>By: Nathan Moore</title>
		<link>http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189816</link>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Moore</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 18:02:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189816</guid>
		<description>Exceptions don't diminish my argument.

I am discussing the aggregate effects. It is simply incorrect to say that there are a significant number of abortions obtained by upper middle class white Republicans to discredit the Roe Effect hypothesis. 

We possess the numbers to show that is not the case. I am talking about majority effects - multiply the 40 million by 0.60 if you want, or 0.55. There is still a colorable effect.  

Taranto breaks down the numbers for me in that WSJ article he did in 2005, so I'm not going to do it again. Quite frankly, I find it compelling. 

As for that post by "William" ... I think it speaks loudly enough for itself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Exceptions don&#8217;t diminish my argument.</p>
<p>I am discussing the aggregate effects. It is simply incorrect to say that there are a significant number of abortions obtained by upper middle class white Republicans to discredit the Roe Effect hypothesis. </p>
<p>We possess the numbers to show that is not the case. I am talking about majority effects - multiply the 40 million by 0.60 if you want, or 0.55. There is still a colorable effect.  </p>
<p>Taranto breaks down the numbers for me in that WSJ article he did in 2005, so I&#8217;m not going to do it again. Quite frankly, I find it compelling. </p>
<p>As for that post by &#8220;William&#8221; &#8230; I think it speaks loudly enough for itself.</p>
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		<title>By: Sean Braisted</title>
		<link>http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189814</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean Braisted</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 17:50:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189814</guid>
		<description>Nathan, 

You are basing your assumption on the idea that all of the women who have abortions are Democrats...utter BS.  There are plenty of little Brentwood Republicans who "take care of the problem" while still dutifully attending church the next day.

The biggest effect seen so far from Roe v. Wade was a dramatic drop in crime in the 1990s.  Why?  Because women know when they can or can't take care of a child.  And a child born to a mother who can't care for it, or will take out their frustrations on the child, is more likely to grow up to be a criminal. 

The other assumption that there is a one-to-one loss in the population rate for every abortion.  There is a very good chance that many women who have had an abortion, will later go on to have babies under more stable conditions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nathan, </p>
<p>You are basing your assumption on the idea that all of the women who have abortions are Democrats&#8230;utter BS.  There are plenty of little Brentwood Republicans who &#8220;take care of the problem&#8221; while still dutifully attending church the next day.</p>
<p>The biggest effect seen so far from Roe v. Wade was a dramatic drop in crime in the 1990s.  Why?  Because women know when they can or can&#8217;t take care of a child.  And a child born to a mother who can&#8217;t care for it, or will take out their frustrations on the child, is more likely to grow up to be a criminal. </p>
<p>The other assumption that there is a one-to-one loss in the population rate for every abortion.  There is a very good chance that many women who have had an abortion, will later go on to have babies under more stable conditions.</p>
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		<title>By: William</title>
		<link>http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189813</link>
		<dc:creator>William</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 17:46:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189813</guid>
		<description>Your reasoning is absurd. This has nothing to do with the politics or views of aborted zygotes. Ridiculous.
 
Abortions, not only in America, but worldwide have declined most where abortion it is safe - legal verified by the Oct. ‘07 World Health Organization report published in The Lancet that found:

&lt;i&gt;The abortion rate decreased more in developed countries, where abortion is generally safe and legal on broad grounds, than in developing countries, where the procedure is largely illegal and unsafe.&lt;/i&gt;

So, anti-women’s rights people, you “pro-lifers” - this is what you’re campaigning for:

    &lt;i&gt;“Each year, about 70,000 women die due to unsafe abortion and an additional five million suffer permanent or temporary disability.”&lt;/i&gt;

    –Dr. Paul F.A. Van Look, director of WHO’s Department of Reproductive Health and Research.

Essentially, what these studies are saying is that if you are anti-choice and would support stripping away women’s reproductive choice - making abortion illegal, you would be increasing the incidence of abortions and the incidence of death and injury to women who seek them.

Great position you have there ‘pro-lifers’ … now isn’t THAT an oxymoron!

See post on http://tennesseefree.com/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your reasoning is absurd. This has nothing to do with the politics or views of aborted zygotes. Ridiculous.</p>
<p>Abortions, not only in America, but worldwide have declined most where abortion it is safe - legal verified by the Oct. ‘07 World Health Organization report published in The Lancet that found:</p>
<p><i>The abortion rate decreased more in developed countries, where abortion is generally safe and legal on broad grounds, than in developing countries, where the procedure is largely illegal and unsafe.</i></p>
<p>So, anti-women’s rights people, you “pro-lifers” - this is what you’re campaigning for:</p>
<p>    <i>“Each year, about 70,000 women die due to unsafe abortion and an additional five million suffer permanent or temporary disability.”</i></p>
<p>    –Dr. Paul F.A. Van Look, director of WHO’s Department of Reproductive Health and Research.</p>
<p>Essentially, what these studies are saying is that if you are anti-choice and would support stripping away women’s reproductive choice - making abortion illegal, you would be increasing the incidence of abortions and the incidence of death and injury to women who seek them.</p>
<p>Great position you have there ‘pro-lifers’ … now isn’t THAT an oxymoron!</p>
<p>See post on <a href="http://tennesseefree.com/" rel="nofollow">http://tennesseefree.com/</a></p>
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		<title>By: Nathan Moore</title>
		<link>http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189809</link>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Moore</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 17:29:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189809</guid>
		<description>That's not what I said, and wouldn't change the point, anyway.

Not having 40 million or so Democrat-leaning voters / households in existence has certainly changed the political makeup of the country. What would these potential children of Democrats likely be doing, besides living in Democrat dominated areas, or voting Democrat themselves?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s not what I said, and wouldn&#8217;t change the point, anyway.</p>
<p>Not having 40 million or so Democrat-leaning voters / households in existence has certainly changed the political makeup of the country. What would these potential children of Democrats likely be doing, besides living in Democrat dominated areas, or voting Democrat themselves?</p>
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		<title>By: Sean Braisted</title>
		<link>http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189803</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean Braisted</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 17:00:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189803</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Certainly there is an effect. Like I said, we can debate the degree, but it is not negligible.&lt;/i&gt;

Show me some evidence that shows that anti-abortion views, in the sense that abortion should be made illegal, is gaining ground?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Certainly there is an effect. Like I said, we can debate the degree, but it is not negligible.</i></p>
<p>Show me some evidence that shows that anti-abortion views, in the sense that abortion should be made illegal, is gaining ground?</p>
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		<title>By: Nathan Moore</title>
		<link>http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189799</link>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Moore</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 16:44:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189799</guid>
		<description>I think I've been reading otherwise as to the liberalness of our generation. I hope so, anyway.

Most people are moderates, who favor fewer abortions, with certain exceptions, but not outright prohibition. Those people aren't necessarily associated with either party and probably split depending on other more pressing issues each cycle.

In the aggregate, the Roe Effect is confirming the obvious regarding those who actually do have abortions. The ardent pro-abortionists who actually have abortions are certainly cutting down on the number of future voters with similar views. Certainly there is an effect. Like I said, we can debate the degree, but it is not negligible.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think I&#8217;ve been reading otherwise as to the liberalness of our generation. I hope so, anyway.</p>
<p>Most people are moderates, who favor fewer abortions, with certain exceptions, but not outright prohibition. Those people aren&#8217;t necessarily associated with either party and probably split depending on other more pressing issues each cycle.</p>
<p>In the aggregate, the Roe Effect is confirming the obvious regarding those who actually do have abortions. The ardent pro-abortionists who actually have abortions are certainly cutting down on the number of future voters with similar views. Certainly there is an effect. Like I said, we can debate the degree, but it is not negligible.</p>
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		<title>By: Sean Braisted</title>
		<link>http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189794</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean Braisted</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 16:18:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moorethoughts.com/2008/01/17/the-roe-effect-democrats-and-shakers/#comment-189794</guid>
		<description>Besides, studies show my generation is one of the most liberal since the 1960s...we are a post-Roe generation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Besides, studies show my generation is one of the most liberal since the 1960s&#8230;we are a post-Roe generation.</p>
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